Evangelical Preachers on Both Sides

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by mattgulptosser, Apr 29, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. mattgulptosser

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2016
    Messages:
    603
    Trophy Points:
    180
    Ratings:
    +1,797
    I prefer the big bang theory because evidence like background EM radiation and the measurable expansion of the universe supports it. I don't actually believe that there was nothing before that "one spec", for the reason you stated. But we just have absolutely no way (currently) to empirically determine what existed before this thing we call the universe did. And I think in that respect, science and faith are at least not at one another's throats, because when grappling with questions that have the enormity of "what existed before the universe did?", then each theory, each belief, is exactly as valuable as the last.
     
  2. Pecci

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2015
    Messages:
    163
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Ratings:
    +297
    Ok. I believe that faith and science MUST be compatible. So, we mostly agree here.

    As far as science goes, we've gone no farther than the tip of the iceberg. We know a trace of all there is to know and we'll never know but a small amount of the whole story. Our own oceans are more than 90-95% mystery.

    However, science will never be able to explain that something can come from nothing. It is unanswerable. Whether there were ingredients for "the soup, a cataclysmic event, or a single spec of dust that grew into everything that is, and btw, still growing. That first spec had to be created and set into motion, by someone that has, by virtue of common sense and reason, been here all along.

    Then there is the story of "life itself", and how it fits in with all else. Where to begin with this?

    .
     
  3. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    You Sir are deluded. Our best times are behind us by any indicators that you wish to choose. Educate yourself and put the rose colored shades away so you might see the demise of our Country.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • List
  4. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    "...will never be able to explain that something can come from nothing. It is unanswerable." That kind of thinking is coming from the dark ages when religion attempted to defeat all Science by converting what were then considered 'incontrovertible' statements into statements of religious delusional law.

    I learned early on that many things were in fact explained after closed minded statements of "will NEVER be able to explain" were laid on them. It is a term used by cults, religions, political entities,...to control particular groups or entities.
     
  5. Larry M

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2016
    Messages:
    3,700
    Trophy Points:
    250
    Location:
    Escondido
    Ratings:
    +9,391
    Name:
    Larry M
    If I knew that a tsunami was coming I would go somewhere safe if I Iived near the water's edge. If I knew that the demise of the country was at hand I would do the same.
     
  6. mattgulptosser

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2016
    Messages:
    603
    Trophy Points:
    180
    Ratings:
    +1,797
    Yeah, I agree. Science doesn't try to explain that something can come from nothing, faith does. I disagree that the two must be compatible.
     
  7. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475
    I have Larry, I have.
     
  8. Larry M

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2016
    Messages:
    3,700
    Trophy Points:
    250
    Location:
    Escondido
    Ratings:
    +9,391
    Name:
    Larry M
    Good for you. If you believe in something strongly take action. Hope that works out for you.
    I would like to leave California because I have the same feelings about this state as you have about the country. But I love the ocean. All of the left coast states are the same so no change there.
    Gulf and eastern states, I don't like the weather there. So here I am, guess I'll just have to suck it up and make the best of it. LOL
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • List
  9. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    We're OLD Larry, no danger to us, it will just get ****tier but tolerable. I got my kid's out of the country over thirty years ago so they are fine. The one that has a house and family here travels internationally, like his brother who has a place in Paris so all cool there and my nieto, who is eleven years old has been on four continents, is conversant in several languages and has friends in numerous countries. This year is Brazil, Sweden, France,...so all good. My bones will be lying on the beach here or metered up on the '43' and I will see (am seeing) the demise of the first, first world country ever to lose it and the end of the Great Experiment.

    Oh, born here, it's been my life, but, after the 'devastation' I wanted a change and for the first time in my life found myself on the Eastern Seaboard for 12 years. With a boat...and I remember parts of it. You don't EVER want to go there Larry. The jarhead that posts here out of North Carolina is absolute poster child for that area.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • List
  10. Larry M

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2016
    Messages:
    3,700
    Trophy Points:
    250
    Location:
    Escondido
    Ratings:
    +9,391
    Name:
    Larry M
    All of that sounds nice.
    Our grandson and granddaughter's mother is from Japan and they go to Japan one or two times a year. Both speak and write fluently in Japanese.
    They have both Japanese and American citizenship now, but I believe when they turn 18 they will have to chose because in Japan you can't have duel citizenship.
    Daughter-in-law is here with a green card. She wants to keep her Japanese citizenship because her parents passed away and she has their home.

    When I was little my uncle worked as a carpenter on the Otay Ranch. There was nothing there for miles around. Sometimes I would spend summers with them.
     
  11. Pecci

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2015
    Messages:
    163
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Ratings:
    +297
    I disagree with what you say ... "faith" does not try to explain something coming from ''anything!" it uses logic and common sense, that there is a supreme being ... since we know something cannot come from nothing.

    Can you state your biggest objection to my claim, that science & faith are compatible? We can go from there.
     
  12. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    "... "faith"...uses logic and common sense, that there is a supreme being ... " contradictory.
     
  13. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    I would sure hang onto Japan as U.S. is...oh well.
     
  14. mattgulptosser

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2016
    Messages:
    603
    Trophy Points:
    180
    Ratings:
    +1,797
    My biggest objection to your claim is that faith fundamentally does not use logic. Although your argument, "There is a supreme being...since we know something cannot come from nothing" is logically sound, as in the proper format, it is not logically valid, because the 'something' that caused or at least came before the 'something' we know today does not specifically have to be a supreme being. There are many, many alternatives.
     
  15. Pecci

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2015
    Messages:
    163
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Ratings:
    +297
    What I tried to say is that while science avoids the subject of the creator and says nothing. People of faith use common sense & know that it is only logical, that something cannot occur without the means of a beginning. It blends together with the belief of a God. Science can not. There is no other possibility, other than a Creator.
     
  16. Rocketship

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2012
    Messages:
    975
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Ratings:
    +1,918
    Boat:
    Skeeter 21i
    I'll be back in San Diego in about 3 weeks. I imagine I'll travel unmolested the whole way. It's nice to know that you generalize the people of a whole area based on your intolerance...real progressive...
     
  17. Pecci

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2015
    Messages:
    163
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Ratings:
    +297
    What other (scientific) alternatives can there be?

    Read my explanation (comment #135) of what I meant by using "logic."

    Please explain "proper format."
     
  18. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475
    If you come in on highway eight you will be molested at least twice in California.
     
  19. Rocketship

    SDFish VIP

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2012
    Messages:
    975
    Trophy Points:
    205
    Location:
    North Carolina
    Ratings:
    +1,918
    Boat:
    Skeeter 21i
    Negative! I've been through those checkpoints many times. To me, that is checking a likely area of illegal immigration for illegal immigrants...you know, according to the law. I've never had an issue there. Of course I obey the laws.

    Now, if I were to travel through, say Iraq, in a private vehicle with no legal documentation or heaven forbid I had a Christian Bible or a copy of "Fingerprints of the Gods" in my possession! Then I'd be beheaded, which is rather extreme molestation. Having to stop and answer a quick question about my citizenship? Not so much.

    I will, however, agree that it is restrictive because of more government control ( liberal application)...
     
  20. rana

    rana Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2017
    Messages:
    233
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Ratings:
    +475

    "I will, however, agree that it is restrictive because of more government control" Good. That's a first step out of your bigotry. Keep it going.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page